[PlayerOneCJ]

Got three games recently that've come in Microsoft's new Wagon Wheel 360 keepcases - DJ Hero, LEGO Rock Band and now Modern Warfare 2. And it got me thinking about packaging. Basically how at least on Microsoft's side it's done nothing but deteriorate over the years. Multi-disc games on one spindle, now we get a keepcase with gaping holes making the whole thing feel less solid or protective. I can appreciate so-called "Green" packaging. But I think the Wagon Wheel keepcases just feel cheap.

And of course on the publisher side you get a game like Modern Warfare 2 which is an assured hit/million-seller/what-have-you and the manual is 6 pages, black & white, with just two images....one a stock photo of the 360 controller and the other a crude wireframe of the in-game HUD. Thank you for providing me the absolute minimum experience for my $60. I understand that no one reads manuals anymore and what have you but MW2 is a game in a million-selling franchise. I'll have to check but I think Oneechanbara, one of the worst 360 games I own, got a better manual that this.

What the hell man?

If you've never seen the Wagon Wheel packaging, here:

[LiK]

i hate the wagon wheel design. if they wanna save the planet, make the 360 suck less energy

[levitynyc]

CJ has obviously not purchased an EA Sports game in a while.

[probune]

I don't own any games with that kind of packaging. Sure does look fugly though. Game cases are flimsy enough even when they don't have giant holes in them, too.

[MojoBox]

Cutting out $.001 worth of plastic is going green? man, they must be seriously desperate to cut costs these days.

[mik]

PS3.

Uncharted 2's packaging is dizzope.

[JDUB X]

I was so surprised to go from Borderlands, which even had fantastic inside case cover art. to $120 DJ Hero which had the shitty Wagon Wheel Pie Slices. ARGH!

[Wenny]

I'm a total green nut, so I'm cool with this packaging. Make 'em shorter too, like PS3 cases. Screw how it looks when it's open...how often are you sitting there admiring your games as they lie open on a table?

[redrock963]

I agree with you that game packaging has gone downhill.

I remember when I bought Order of Eclasia last year, I coudn't wait to flip through the manual (cause I bought it on my lunch break at work) and was disappointed to see that the manual was only like, 6 or 8 pages long. Well, I take that back, the English section was that long. No character art, no story, no nothing. It made me feel sad because that is my favorite thing about looking at manuals is the character art.

That wagon wheel design looks stupid too. If they want to save money why don't they do the slimmer, jewel-case style packaging like the PS3?

I remember being happy that the PS1 and Dreamcast finally started having their packaging in easy to manage jewel cases, then the PS2 era switched it to bulky DVD cases. At first it was nice because those cases had a memory card slot, but now they don't even do THAT anymore.

[PlayerOneStewy]

PlayerOneCJ, on 10 November 2009 - 05:49 PM, said:

I understand that no one reads manuals anymore and what have you but MW2 is a game in a million-selling franchise. I'll have to check but I think Oneechanbara, one of the worst 360 games I own, got a better manual that this.

Come on man...seriously? Someone has to get paid to write, lay out, and manufacture that shit that no one reads. Why do you care that they're not needlessly spending money on it? Are you running some sort of museum?

[Wenny]

PlayerOneStewy, on 10 November 2009 - 07:05 PM, said:

Are you running some sort of museum?

Do you have to ask this? Haven't you noticed that CJ doesn't actually play the games he buys? He's the only person I know of who routinely spends $60 on 4 hour "rentals"...

[Tigerriot]

I'm totally with CJ on this. Modern Warfare 2 was the first 360 game I've got with this new ridiculous "eco case". It actually says that on the inside of it. You want a real "eco case" Microsoft? How about shrinking down your damn cases to Bluray size, or maybe even CD case size? What is wrong with that? Instead they choose to give us this bullshit flimsy piece of junk that is simply not as sturdy.

Instead of weakening the structural integrity of the case, just make it SMALLER! Duh.

I also have to agree with CJ in that I cannot understand how games like Dirt 2 come with full color manuals, but then publishers like EA and Activision do the absolute bare minimum with their games that will sell WAY more than Dirt 2 could ever dream of selling. It seems like the more successful the product, the more they want to cheapen up on it. Weird.

Also, one last conspiratorial note to ponder. I can't help but wonder if a company like Microsoft is interested in making game packaging as meaningless as possible, in a slow attempt at devaluing the disc based version of games. Setting the table for what they are quickly hoping becomes a digital only future.

I'm all about the hard copy for any game that I pay $60 for.

[I AM JOHN!]

Wenny, on 10 November 2009 - 07:09 PM, said:

Do you have to ask this? Haven't you noticed that CJ doesn't actually play the games he buys? He's the only person I know of who routinely spends $60 on 4 hour "rentals"...

Uh... have you not seen my post in the Purchases thread?

I'm all for eco-friednly packaging, but could they at least not make it so goddamn ugly and horrible?

[Wenny]

I AM JOHN!, on 10 November 2009 - 07:29 PM, said:

I'm all for eco-friednly packaging, but could they at least not make it so goddamn ugly and horrible?

Do you sit around staring at the inside of your game cases?

I think I'm also immune to this because I've been getting DVDs with a similar case design for months and months. These cases use 1/3 less plastic so for a hit game like CoD 6 it saves millions of cases from being produced and basically wasted. Good move Activision and Microsoft!

Now going cheap on the manual is just profit maximization through and through. Is anyone surprised that Activision would do this? Really?

[PlayerOneStewy]

Sturdiness is really an issue? What are you people doing with your game cases? Mine sit on my shelves, and occassionally get thrown around by my children, and even the one or two eco-cases I've got have yet to break. Of course, even before this the spindles would show up broken once in a while, older cases and all.

I agree, CD-sized jewel cases were awesome. They also could barely survive a four-foot fall onto a hardwood floor.

And I still can't fathom why folks are so up in arms over short, B&W manuals. I'm sure there are a few exceptions to the rule, but by and large, people just don't read the things. Spending money on something no one looks at is the pinnacle of stupid when you're supposed to be running a business.

[PlayerOneStewy]

Tigerriot, on 10 November 2009 - 08:26 PM, said:

Instead of weakening the structural integrity of the case, just make it SMALLER! Duh.

Something else - just making the cases smaller will actually cost Microsoft and all of their publishers extra money should they want to run a new printing of an existing game. You know, one that already has one of the larger manuals. Not to mention the cost of redesigning the box art and text.

[msaeger]

I agree the holes are silly but I dis-like the lack of manuals even more. Sure I don't read them to help play the game but being a crazy collector I do enjoy going back and reading through them years later and for me it adds value to the game. Worrying about using less plastic on something that isn't disposable is silly. If they really are doing this to save plastic I would rather they made the cases solid and made them shorter like the size of the disk.

[Outlaw Moogle]

...I read the manual

[Wenny]

msaeger, on 10 November 2009 - 08:22 PM, said:

I agree the holes are silly but I dis-like the lack of manuals even more. Sure I don't read them to help play the game but being a crazy collector I do enjoy going back and reading through them years later and for me it adds value to the game. Worrying about using less plastic on something that isn't disposable is silly. If they really are doing this to save plastic I would rather they made the cases solid and made them shorter like the size of the disk.

Going shorter - like Blu-Ray or PS3 cases - only uses 12-15% less plastic. Ideally shrink them to blu-ray size and still carve out the trivial pursuit wedges for a plastic saving that approaches 50%. Oh and saying a game case "isn't disposable" is a little naive. Most plastic ends up in landfills or incinerators eventually - even game cases. Only a handful of counties/cities in the US have recycling facilities for handling DVD/game cases even though game cases are just as one-time recyclable as any other plastic.

[Tigerriot]

Wenny, on 10 November 2009 - 07:04 PM, said:

I think I'm also immune to this because I've been getting DVDs with a similar case design for months and months. These cases use 1/3 less plastic so for a hit game like CoD 6 it saves millions of cases from being produced and basically wasted. Good move Activision and Microsoft!

33% less plastic? I don't believe that for a second.

[Wenny]

Tigerriot, on 10 November 2009 - 08:44 PM, said:

33% less plastic? I don't believe that for a second.

I don't expect you to. You've never been one to like actual data.

[atat23]

PlayerOneStewy, on 11 November 2009 - 01:10 AM, said:

Sturdiness is really an issue? What are you people doing with your game cases?

the usual, building small domiciles out of them, propping up the car when I need to change a tire etc



I like the design and 3D textures on the borderlands sleeve but sleeves on games kinda piss me off, I like to keep my games in good nick and if I don't keep the sleeve on the game I'm afraid it will get squished, means I have to continuously take them off and put them on again! My games all have to go into the right boxes, just before an someone suggests I use an alternative box. So go green and get rid of cardboard sleeves.

I think it was Afrika that had a manual that I was pretty impressed with, it was really thick and, lot's of pretty crap in it, but in all honesty I'll probably never look at it again, I think companies have pretty much given up on manuals these days but I don't really mind since they were never something I took time to look at.

Companies seem to be happy just to strip the manual down, slap all the art from the manual into an art book, make the packaging better, throw in some crappy €2.99 DLC and calling it a collector's edition. It ain't right but we all know what these feckers are like......they are businesses.

[Ondore]

I think the ideal case would be something slightly larger than a DS game case. It's a good size for a disc, and it can survive the aforementioned 4-foot drop to the floor. As it is, those eco-cases would probably tear if I applied a pound of pressure to the back.

[Jonnjonzz]

There are holes in the packaging for the same reasons some companies are getting away from those awful sealed plastic packages. Plastic is made of oils and oil costs a lot of money.

[Cerulean Blue]

Tigerriot, on 10 November 2009 - 06:26 PM, said:

I'm totally with CJ on this. Modern Warfare 2 was the first 360 game I've got with this new ridiculous "eco case". It actually says that on the inside of it. You want a real "eco case" Microsoft? How about shrinking down your damn cases to Bluray size, or maybe even CD case size? What is wrong with that? Instead they choose to give us this bullshit flimsy piece of junk that is simply not as sturdy.

Tigerriot, on 02 September 2009 - 03:22 PM, said:

Holy shit! They really are changing their entire game case design. I saw some people on a forum talking about that a week ago, but I just assumed they were speculating.

This is just great. Last year at this time Sony revised their cases to show "Playstation Network", and "Only on Playstation". I guess those dolts are going for a record for most case redesigns in a generation. Kind of fits their pattern though. Flailing wildly at any idea they can think of. Seriously, let's chill with the changes. You're not in last place because of your case graphics. We all know it was about price, and you've made a major improvement on that front recently.

You're sending mixed messages.

[atat23]

Ondore, on 11 November 2009 - 01:51 AM, said:

I think the ideal case would be something slightly larger than a DS game case. It's a good size for a disc, and it can survive the aforementioned 4-foot drop to the floor. As it is, those eco-cases would probably tear if I applied a pound of pressure to the back.

DS cases are really good quality though, the plastic is alot thicker so they probably use the same ammount of plastic, if not more, as the bigger cases. It would kind of make the whole "green" excuse pointless.



edit: holy fuck ryan, that's just sad that you'd even bother!

[Wenny]

Ondore, on 10 November 2009 - 08:51 PM, said:

I think the ideal case would be something slightly larger than a DS game case. It's a good size for a disc, and it can survive the aforementioned 4-foot drop to the floor. As it is, those eco-cases would probably tear if I applied a pound of pressure to the back.

Well, the eco-cases that have come with kids DVDs we've gotten have survived a 6 and 4 year old.

[PlayerOneCJ]

PlayerOneStewy, on 10 November 2009 - 07:05 PM, said:

Come on man...seriously? Someone has to get paid to write, lay out, and manufacture that shit that no one reads. Why do you care that they're not needlessly spending money on it? Are you running some sort of museum?

So in that case why not go all the way to a digital download future since no one reads the printed materials nor cares what kind of case their games come in. I'm not saying a manual has to be lushly illustrated a la Nintendo's pretty damn awesome New Super Mario Bros. Wii booklet/packaging, but jeez, be more than a 6-page "operations manual."

Have you looked at the manual for Ratchet & Clank Crack in Time or Uncharted 2 or Halo ODST or (insert name of big-name game here)? That's amazing stuff.

[PlayerOneCJ]

ryan_gilaben, on 10 November 2009 - 09:01 PM, said:

You're sending mixed messages.

Not to ruin the "let's jump on the things Tigerriot posts" party here but I think the two issues these comments were made on are fairly different. (At least, I view them that way.)

[Raughn]

Ondore, on 10 November 2009 - 08:51 PM, said:

I think the ideal case would be something slightly larger than a DS game case. It's a good size for a disc, and it can survive the aforementioned 4-foot drop to the floor. As it is, those eco-cases would probably tear if I applied a pound of pressure to the back.

I think you've got it right there. I was thinking CD-size jewel cases until Greg reminded me about them exploding when dropped. It's best to go small, soft and avoid hinges (thatswhatshesaid).

Not that I'm too worried about the wagon wheels. I can only imagine them not protecting discs in very unusual situations.

[PlayerOneStewy]

PlayerOneCJ, on 10 November 2009 - 10:21 PM, said:

So in that case why not go all the way to a digital download future since no one reads the printed materials nor cares what kind of case their games come in. I'm not saying a manual has to be lushly illustrated a la Nintendo's pretty damn awesome New Super Mario Bros. Wii booklet/packaging, but jeez, be more than a 6-page "operations manual."

Have you looked at the manual for Ratchet & Clank Crack in Time or Uncharted 2 or Halo ODST or (insert name of big-name game here)? That's amazing stuff.

Sure, but honestly, what more does the manual really have to convey except how to play the game? You said yourself that no one reads them.

If a publisher makes the choice to go all out and produce a large, full-color manual, then hey, good for them. But I still don't see how not doing so is such a big deal.

And they won't go all the way to a digital download future right now because it doesn't make any sense yet.

[PlayerOneStewy]

PlayerOneCJ, on 10 November 2009 - 10:24 PM, said:

Not to ruin the "let's jump on the things Tigerriot posts" party here but I think the two issues these comments were made on are fairly different. (At least, I view them that way.)

I agree. I don't think the two statements have all that much to do with each other.

[I AM JOHN!]

Wenny, on 10 November 2009 - 08:04 PM, said:

Do you sit around staring at the inside of your game cases?

A fair point, true, but I wish they had a better design. The way they look now, I can completely see how people would be afraid that they're flimsy and liable to break easily.

[MojoBox]

I remember when I was a kid living in rural Utah and the nearest videogame store was an hour away. Well, nearest Wal-mart. Nearest videogame store was 2 hours away. Anyways, I used to read game manuals cover to cover repeatedly until I could get home. That kid would be sorely disappointed with today's anemic, black and white game manuals.

Man that sucked... the wrangling I had to go through to get a gold copy of OoT...

[PlayerOneStewy]

That kid's also probably listening to his mp3 player, watching a movie on the in-car DVD system, or texting his friends at a rate that is sure to put his parents in the poor house

[redrock963]

Something tells me that one rogue pen or some other sharp object could easily puncture one of those wagon wheel cases where there's no plastic. I've seen it happen with that one missing plastic part on the PS2 and Gamecube cases.

The mere thought of that makes my poor "Keep the case in mint condition" brain turn into a headspin.

Also, I'm curious... they're trying to make these with less plastic to help "reduce landfill waste" But who actually buys a game and keeps a disc and throws away the case?

[levitynyc]

Isn't plastic just a biproduct of oil production? Isn't it produced regardless?

[ness08]

MojoBox, on 10 November 2009 - 08:38 PM, said:

I remember when I was a kid living in rural Utah and the nearest videogame store was an hour away. Well, nearest Wal-mart. Nearest videogame store was 2 hours away. Anyways, I used to read game manuals cover to cover repeatedly until I could get home. That kid would be sorely disappointed with today's anemic, black and white game manuals.

Man that sucked... the wrangling I had to go through to get a gold copy of OoT...

Change Utah to Colorado and that was pretty much my childhood too. I would read the manual once or twice before I even got home then start playing. Sometimes if I really liked the game I would take the whole game with me when we went to 'town' and just read the manual.

Now though I just flip through it. If it has some story stuff in there I will read it, but other than that, I don't read much of anything in there.

[Tron]

I also think the new cases are junk. Another reason I'm glad I got MW2 on PS3.

[I AM JOHN!]

redrock963, on 10 November 2009 - 09:51 PM, said:

I've seen it happen with that one missing plastic part on the PS2 and Gamecube cases.

Yeah what was with that? I never understood why GameCube cases had that weird groove at the bottom.